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How do we keep our kids safe online? How do we protect our children in an overexposed, sexualized culture?
Join Mandy Majors (award-winning author of "TALK" and "Keeping Kids Safe in a Digital World") for real conversations about the intersection of tech, culture and faith.
nextTalk is a 501(c)(3) nonprofit organization keeping kids safe by creating a culture of open communication in families, churches and schools.
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Raising Athletes Without Losing What Matters Most
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What if the real win in youth sports isn’t a trophy or scholarship, but a kid who knows who they are?
In this episode, we sit down with Merideth Zingelmann, Operations Manager at nextTalk and mom of three college athletes, to unpack a practical path for families who love sports but refuse to let it run their lives. From backyard games and rec leagues to varsity pressure and recruiting, we talk about how to build community, protect identity, and keep faith at the center.
RESOURCES
Be A Safe Space - https://nexttalk.org/podcast_episode/build-a-safe-place/
Let Your Kid Struggle - https://nexttalk.org/podcast_episode/let-your-kid-struggle/
Influenced - https://nexttalk.org/podcast_episode/influenced/
4 Reasons to Keep Screens Out of Bedrooms and Bathrooms - https://nexttalk.org/podcast_episode/four-reasons-i-kept-screens-out-of-my-kids-bedroom-and-bathroom/
Phone Free Schools - https://nexttalk.org/podcast_episode/phone-free-schools-mom-on-a-mission/
Boundaries - https://nexttalk.org/podcast_episode/boundaries/
Pornography - https://nexttalk.org/podcast_episode/pornography/
Consent - https://nexttalk.org/podcast_episode/consent/
Good counselors are booked. What can I do while I wait? - https://nexttalk.org/podcast_episode/good-counselors-are-booked-what-can-i-do-while-we-wait/
Music: https://www.purple-planet.com
KEEPING KIDS SAFE ONLINE
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Welcome to the Next Talk Podcast. We are a nonprofit passionate about keeping kids safe online. We're learning together how to navigate tech, culture, and faith with our kids. I'd like to introduce you to our operations manager at nextTalk, who's normally behind the camera and handles all of our programs, oversees all of our programs. Her name is Merideth Zingelmann.
Speaker 2:Hello. Thank you for having me. How does it feel being in front of the camera? A little awkward, but I do understand how everybody feels now on this side of it. Usually I'm on, well, I'm not even on the editing side. I'm just on the review side. So I even get to see it after our podcast manager does her magic. So yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah. It's it's kind of weird. It is a little weird. Yes. Well, thank you for joining us. I have been thinking of this show for a while because I have raised an athlete who is now a senior and graduating. So we're finishing up that chapter. Uh, but we get calls and I get questions from parents about my kid wants to play college sports, or my kid is in the middle of this. You know, do you have any advice from me? And I'm always like, get on the phone with Meredith. Because she has all three of your kids have played college sports. Yes. And they're grown and she's just has a beautiful family. And so I wanted you guys to meet her and hear some of her advice. But first, before we get into all of that, I want you to kind of introduce yourself a little bit more. Tell us a little bit.
Speaker 2:It's not the easiest part for me, but um I'm Merideth and uh my husband and I have been married 30 years. He would like for me to give a shout-out that our kids are all athletes because he was an amazing athlete at his 2A high school in Rogers, Texas, growing up. But anyway, you can cut that if you want to. I have to be funny in it or I'm gonna drown. So we're giving a shout out to the husband, but also, but also saying 2A.
Speaker 1:Also 2A.
Speaker 2:But he did play every sport and both ways of all sports and all those things. But um anyway, we've been married 30 years. We have three awesome kids, uh, grown adults. They're great kids. And um I love sports, I love talking about sports. So when you asked me to do this, I was like, yes, but I hope I say what I want to say and get it the right way. So I'm honored, I'm honored to work at Next Talk and help families navigate through all the different um things that come at, come at our kids and families. Um, but I really, I really feel um a big heart for student athletes and for parents of athletes and coaches. And I just feel like the sports community and the sports world is just a very special place. So I'm honored to talk about it.
Speaker 1:Well, and she's been my go-to, I've mentor through this journey because our son, who's the baby, was the first athlete, and we really weren't athletes. So it was a whole new world to Matt and I. And she's just been a wealth of information on calming me down and saying, don't call coach, don't do this.
Speaker 2:Well, I'm not an athlete myself. I mean, I ran track and cross-country, and I wasn't raised an athlete. I had friends that were athletes. I was a little bit envious of them, and um I've cheered for them and was a cheerleader. And I would get, I remember get going to one of them. They were like at state in volleyball or something, and I remember thinking, why in the heck am I over here cheering? Not to not cheering. It's amazing, but I remember being like, I wish I was playing. And so that little influence kind of influenced me when I was parenting my girls because I was kind of like, get in there and play and see what you think of it. Do all the things, you know. But um it is a special place, especially having a senior, you're coming to the end of it. So it's a nostalgic time on your heart. So it's a good time to ask me to come on. And I wish I had a big answer and like my spiel was going to be like how to get you that big NIL deal or how to um play power for sports. That's actually not what we're talking about today. So if you tuned in thinking it was that, you know, maybe it's the wrong, wrong podcast. But for us, like raising kids that are athletes and raising successful kids was more about the community and the uh family and the um successes as our family grew around sports and what sports did for us as a family unit, whether we look back nostalgically and happy and laugh about it all and the good times we had around sports, um, not just not just high school sports or college sports, but even sports in our backyard and um on the street and playing when they were younger. And so um that's kind of the avenue I look at, like how to maintain the relationship and how to grow your family through that and to parent through it, because it's I would like to say I had all those solutions and the perfect way to do it right off the bat. But after 20 years, 20 plus years of watching kids, my own kids play, I have a little bit of insight, but I know you're passionate, I know you're passionate about this subject. Yeah, I do.
Speaker 1:So, first of all, I want to clarify you have three kids, two girls, the oldest, and the boy as the youngest. Correct. So I just want to clarify that. For sure. When did you guys start? And what was your mentality? Like, were you always thinking, okay, my my goal here is to get them to play college sports? Like, tell us about that.
Speaker 2:Um, our goal was just to be in a community. Like we were all going when they started. Um, we had some friends, we met through church, they loved sports. One of the dads was gonna coach, I think it was soccer that we started with. And um, you know, did we want to join the team? It was just that kind of situation. Um, I guess we had some Saturdays open because we were like, let's sign up and do that on Saturdays. And um, I remember it's funny, we we were gonna start out. I think my oldest was four at the time, and she saw the uniform and just absolutely refused, vehemently refused to wear black shorts. Like, no. And so I was like, okay, well, then we're not gonna play. And she was like, okay, then I'm not gonna play. And we didn't play. So that first year we just were like, y'all go play and have fun. And then when she started asking to do those kinds of things with her friends, then we went in. So um it was pretty young. I mean, I don't think that there's a set age or that people should feel behind if they're not doing sport activities like that for us. It was just around our community and um we really liked it, we really enjoyed it. As soon as the little sister could join, we did it that way. Um, when when my son got older, to where um if we could ever arrange to have them on the same teams, we always did because it was just fun. Even that that meant some were playing up or some were playing with boys or uh that kind of thing. Um, we always did it. You know, we would just try to see how we could get the family together and the community together and and we did sports around that, if that makes sense.
Speaker 1:I love that the goal wasn't to be like at four years old, you're gonna be a college athlete. That wasn't the goal at all. The goal was we want to find community, get out, be active, compete. You know, you are a competitive family because of your husband in all the sports. Yeah, all the sports in his athlete in his athletic career. Exactly. Right. And so, um, and I also think it's so good to like when they're young, how important is it for them to try all different kinds of like don't hone in on what you like.
Speaker 2:For sure. Well, you know, uh my husband and I, we weren't we weren't superstars at one sport. Like I said, I didn't play sports, I watched a lot of football. That's what I grew up watching with my dad. I loved watching football on the weekends. We watched NFL teams, we had our team. I'm from the like McMahon era, you know, and it was a thing with the the Super Bowl shuffle. I was into it all. So I didn't really have a big picture of all the different sports that were offered for youth. But if the kids wanted to try it and we could work it in, we did. And I mean, it it ranged anywhere from gymnastics to karate to swimming to soccer to volleyball to, I mean, just just kind of whatever. Now, I'll say that in the sense that you can expose your kids to all kinds of different sports without having to participate in all those things. You know, a lot of parents grew up playing a sport, so they play it with their kiddos outside. I highly recommend that. Like playing, you know, um, with YouTube around these days. We talk about YouTube as a social media platform, but it's also an educational platform where you can be exposed to so many fantastic sports or fun drills to do with your kid, that type of thing. Um so, yes, we played a lot of different sports and a lot of activities, but again, we kept them based off of friend groups and community. I highly recommend any inexpensive routes you can find like that, like um neighborhood swim teams, fantastic at skills and learning um how to be safe around the water, that type of thing. That's really what we spent the bulk of the, I would say the elementary school days on was just exploring different sports, finding out what we liked, watching sports. I cannot encourage you enough to watch sports with your kiddo. If your kid likes going to soccer, start watching soccer games on TV. Um, highly recommend all of the school sports. Like if your kid is a baseball player, start going to high school baseball games. Same with basketball. Get to know the school that you feed into. A lot of them offer like they need ball kids or they need um, they'll do like an elementary school night at your high school. Go to those. It's super inexpensive to watch those teams. And the concession stands are super inexpensive, also, which I love, um, mostly run by volunteers in the community. So you can really learn a lot about all the sports by watching the sports years ahead of you and your community. I mean, if you know you're gonna stay in one area for sure, definitely that's where you should be on Friday nights, is trying to see what their sports are like. And um, it tells you a lot uh about how much your kid likes it, if they like to watch it and then they like to emulate what they see.
Speaker 1:Well, and I was just kind of thinking about as you talked, I know when your kids were younger, like cell phones weren't a thing when your kids were really young and you were doing all this stuff. Well, one of them anyway.
Speaker 2:The youngest had them. I mean, the youngest was there, but the older ones not.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah. So now though, with the shift, you know, with Jonathan Hyde, we followed his. What a great way to be more outside, more, be more active. For sure. It's a way also you're building community with your people. Your kids are learning different sports, different things they like and don't like, and you're keeping them off screens. For sure. You they're being they're being more active.
Speaker 2:I don't know his exact data on it, but he did cite it in his book to discussing um athletes and screens and um and how they don't see some of the same patterns, mostly because of the time.
Speaker 1:They don't have the time to be on their phones as much as I think that he said um sports and faith families, because both of them have time set apart from screens. Right. And I love your idea too of like you know, go to the Friday night games of your feeder school because that helps your your smaller child set a goal. Like I want to be on the high school team. For sure. I remember I had a coach one time talk told my son young when he was younger, and he said, son, if you make it to senior year and you're one of 12 or 14 men on a team, that's a huge accomplishment. For sure. And now my son's a senior and he's on the team, and we keep coming back to that. Wow, what an accomplishment that you have worked really hard to get here, you know, and even though it's ending and it's bittersweet, it's it's it's also like a reward for all his hard work. Absolutely. The goal setting, I think, is huge in the world.
Speaker 2:It is and it's and like you can become a fan of that school and that that environment, whether you end up playing that sport or not. Yeah. I mean, we have pictures of my kids, and we were fortunate enough to grow up in the same neighborhood. My kids, we were always there, but they, you know, they would go to the games and take a picture with the mascot when they're younger. And to me, one of the things with school sports, especially, is that sense of community. And college sports, it's a sense of community. It just gives you a sense of belonging that's outside of yourself and outside of your family. One thing that was so great about being with your community is that you could see kids grow up, or my kids would see older kids and see them have success. And we learn to celebrate other people's wins and other people accomplishing their goals and kind of walk ahead of what that looked like, the the other folks. And it, you know, I mentioned like summer league swimming, if you have a neighborhood basketball team, if you have a neighborhood soccer team, those kinds of community-based organizations where you're having fun together are just so great. And um that's really kind of how it started for all of us. We didn't really have any intentions necessarily of it going, even really knowing that it would go on in through high school. It was really just about making friends and kind of putting our roots down here in, you know, in the San Antonio area and and celebrating being outside and being together and the families having fun or inside playing basketball or volleyball. But it was just to experience exercise and kind of have a community. And that's that's really how it all started.
Speaker 1:So it started that way. Started that way. But eventually your kids are really passionate about one sport and you're thinking they could play college. They do want to play college. That's a goal of theirs. Right. So when that starts happening, tell me about year-round sports because that's a that's a controversial topic, I think.
Speaker 2:I know it really has become that way. And I think mostly because of social media has so much um controversy discussions that it's become controversial in most sports, as you get to the high school level, the impact players or those and those that go on and play in college are usually involved somehow with club or year-round sports. Kind of a lot of the negatives on it are is that limits kids into playing less sports, like they can't try them all if you're involved in clubs. And that and that does tend to be true in some aspects. If the child's heart mirrors the opportunity and you kind of are watching them like, okay, yeah, they seem like they might be pretty good at it, then you could explore into it. You could step into it. Just because you enter the world into club sports doesn't mean it's forever and ever and always, and that's how it's gonna be. Our family really tried to focus on seasons. Um, I had different kids tried different club sports. Um, it's not the ones they play in college, but they still wanted to experience that sport at a different level. You have to really play out whether or not it's beneficial for your child. There's some really fancy, high-level travel, best of the best teams. But if your child isn't going to be playing, they're going to be mostly sitting on the bench. Is it really what you want? There's a lot of great club experiences. And in the same sense, you don't want to be the one on the bench, but you also don't want to be the one that's playing every minute and not challenged by your teammates, which is another aspect of it. So there's a lot that goes into it. There's a lot of um negativity that goes into it because it is cutthroat. For us, they were positive experiences. We didn't stay with one club all through all of their playing years. Sometimes we left and sometimes we went to different teams, and sometimes we moved to a different city. Some we did all kinds of things. And it didn't always work out the way we wanted it to, but we always handled it um in a professional way. I would say that families need to realize that it is a business, it is a business for the coaching aspect, and it should be approached that way with your kiddo, I believe.
Speaker 1:Okay, so we're talking a lot about sports, which is awesome because there's so many amazing life lessons that you get from sports. And I've seen that in my son. Amazing. But I can already hear some people digesting this show. And I know you, I know that you are you've kept your kids grounded in the faith, and this was a major component in your life.
Speaker 2:For sure.
Speaker 1:But there's reels out there on social media that will say, you know, don't do sports, get your kid, and you've seen it, you know, you can't take soccer to heaven, but you can take your kid to heaven. I like it. So you can do both. I want this is what I want you to speak into. I want you to speak into this idea of if we do club sports or if we do this, how does it not become our God? Because it can, it can become an idol in your life. Give us some practical ways that you maintain the balance through the years.
Speaker 2:First of all, I would say from the outside looking in, it might appear a lot of times when you look at people's schedules that their God might be something different than God. Because, and that is something as a parent of an athlete, I thought about a lot. And I think a lot of parents do, where you want to find a balance, you're trying to help them achieve their hopes and dreams. At the same time, you're like, where do we belong? Like, where should we be? For us, we were able to intertwine our faith with the activities, and it worked out for us. Do I still wonder sometimes? Maybe we should, you know, I mean, I don't wouldn't say I have any regrets, but you make the best decisions you can at the time and you move forward. And that's what we did. There were a lot of things that we did to incorporate our faith into our daily lives. And so there was never a time where the Zinglemans are at church, and that's when we're with God. The Zinglemans were with God all the time. And that was very intentional on my husband and I's part. It wasn't a one-way or one way and one way or another way. Now, I'm not saying we're perfect and I'm not saying we all got it right all the time, but the intentions of us were to weave our spirituality into everything that we were doing. Now, my my kids did network and go to faith-based events outside of Sundays. They were involved in other activities, young life, youth groups at churches. Um, and that helped along the lines of that also. We did something called home church, which was just something I thought of one day when we all came in and had missed church and we were all at different activities and carding and going back and forth, which was basically everybody go up to your room for 15 minutes, bring church to the kitchen table. And that stuck. My kids really liked it. They could come and they could bring anything. We had to tie it in with our faith and with God. But it didn't necessarily always have to be a Bible story. And it would bring be different types of stories. It started when my son was really little and we kept it going through the years, even after one went to college. She would FaceTime into it. Once COVID hit and we were all kind of back home together, it was different. But that really brought church around our timeframe. Now it wasn't in a building, but it was a way for us to keep grounded in our faith, talk about what we believe, and talk about how that related to what we were going through currently. I do understand the concern of giving your money and your time and your everything to how it can look like it's your God. I do understand how people say that. I think that the reels are a little mean because they're generalized. I don't feel like anything where it says all are and none should is necessarily the right fit for everybody. For us, my children were all raised intertwining the sports with their faith. They were able to live them out daily. And it was something that we talked about. We prayed before every game. We have scripture that we prayed over athletes, Luke 2.52, growing wisdom and strength in favor of God and love by many. That was what we wanted to be on our teams. We wanted to be strong. We wanted our teammates to love us. So we kind of intertwined it all with our daily activities. I don't know if that answers your questions.
Speaker 1:No, I think it's great. And I, and now I feel like when your kids were younger, we didn't have this. But now, since like we have online church that is makes it, I know for us doing some traveling here in the high school years, online church has been great that we'll watch in the car, you know, as we're traveling or whatever. Right. Um, and then also just you can visit other churches. I think it's a great way to visit in other areas.
Speaker 2:They met a lot of kids that went to different churches. Yeah. And that's one thing you saw in sports, your teammates. Um, maybe kids were going through confirmation. And so they were like, what's that? And they would learn about things like that, um, which they may not have had we not met them in those kinds of intimate travel team settings. Um, the other thing I was gonna say that I think is super important is not just online church, but like online church, but then discuss it together as a family. And I think that's one thing that kind of set us apart is the things that were going on, we talked about a lot as a family. Like, oh, I I saw such and such during the game. What do you think of that? What how did that happen? You know, what was your response? Or what did Coach say? But what did you think of it? What was your response? Uh, you know, and and delving that just kind of in more than just playing a game and then you win and you go get ice cream. I we just dove in headfirst to so much of it, realizing that they're spending a lot of their time on it. It grows their character. So you've got to pour into how you want the lights to shine out of it. Well, it's discipleship.
Speaker 1:Well, you're you're you're using sports, you're using their environment to talk about their culture, things they're hearing, seeing. It's all it's next box stuff, really, if you think about it, right? Um, I love that. You guys have been such a family of open communication and talking through things as they've grown. So, so I love how you paint a picture of church doesn't have to be a building. Like we're doing that every day. We're we're talking about how this situation over here, what is our what does scripture say about that? You're doing that in the car, you're doing that on the way to practice. You're doing it's a normal rhythm in your life. I love that answer. Let's talk about, you know, varsity sports. We're here. Give us some advice because I I will tell you, I'm gonna be honest with y'all. It's way more competitive than I ever imagined. And even as I remember watching my son play as a freshman, and I remember my husband and I saying, there's no way he'll play varsity. Like we're we're gonna exit. This is like a lot. And here we are, senior year, and he's he's playing varsity, right? And it's been such a great experience for him. The brotherhood on the team, the faith is very integrated. And I do like what you say too. Um, you you said earlier, like you're not married to that team. You're not to like a club team or whatever. And I think also like if faith is really important and you're they're around a group that you're like, oh, I don't know. Like it may not be the right fit for you because you may want your kid to be influenced more over here on this club team where faith is more centered or the coach is more faithful. You know, like like there's lots of options there that you can watch for sure. And like the influence of the other kids on your on your kid, right? Is is my kid able to, and that's you're gonna get that through the conversations. If my kid can hold up to this or this is a serious situation, I probably need to pull my kid off from this and we need to get with another group, right? But it gives you all those different options to kind of move with their friend group to introduce them to new people too, for sure. Which is a positive, I think. Mm-hmm in the club environment for sure. Yeah, yeah. So, so then let's go back to varsity, though. So varsity is highly competitive. And um give us some advice. If you have parents out there that their kids are say entering high school and they're wanting to go the varsity route and play through at least high school, sure. What do you got for us? Welcome to high school now.
Speaker 2:It's a lot I love high school sports. I still go to high school games, even though I don't have a kiddo in high school. I love high school sports in all aspects. And and predominantly what we're discussing today are team sports. But if you haven't been to a track meet lately, you really should go to a track meet and swim meets. They're so much fun. But I um it is competitive. It's people that live in that area. One of my girls and I, um, my middle daughter, we laugh a lot because we'll say, Man, that high school team is so good. And she's like, it's just people that live in that area. How did that happen? You know, because it is the your community. So the same people that we would play sports with when my son was in elementary school, we then grew up and they all played in high school sports together. And they're just young men that have grown up and are like, yes, I'll go play. You know, I reference a lot to football because football gives doesn't have typically a club football. So kids can play other sports when they play high school football and then they they bring in a lot more athletes. You know, a lot of athletes end up playing high school football that didn't have to play club and all those other things along the way. But high school sports, I really have, I think, two main things I would teach parents if I could. And and a lot of my conversation comes from preventing a negative, really. Okay. Um, I would say enjoy it. That would be one positive. Have fun, even though it's hard, even though it's hard to navigate through it sometimes. The first thing I would teach parents is everyone has a role on the team. And you hear that as a cliche, like, oh, everyone has a role on the team. But I mean it. Everyone has a role on the team. You can go, you know how earlier I was saying go to those high school games and watch the bench. And you'll see the kids who really impact a game, even from the bench. Or when the coach calls them in, boom, they're jogging out there. Other kids are running off. Like you can tell the body language and the participation and the fact that they're all involved and all in. We all in our hearts want our kids to be the superstar. Who we're it's natural, but it's they must learn at a very little age and all the way up through college that they are more than their playing time. They are more than that student athlete. They are a child of God. And I was saying earlier how we wove in our spirituality and our faith in God and what Jesus has done for us into our sports. And I mean it. You can go through almost anything in life and sports if you know who you are. And that to me is the key. If your child doesn't want to be an athlete at all, who are they? If if your child is the superstar, who are you really? You're a child of God. And that has been something that is a huge key because I see so much disappointment in the system when everyone's trying to be something outside of the child, everyone's trying to be something more powerful or they think is more powerful than the child of God. The sun doesn't rise and set by wins and losses on your teams. The sun doesn't rise and set by NIL deals and how who's playing division one, who's playing division three, or whether you're um all state. The sun rises and sets because the Lord God declares it so. And they brought your child into this world. And finding that space of knowing your value kind of helps you play free. You're gonna make mistakes out there. There's going to be kids that are better than you. Every kid that I've ever seen play. And I've seen some really fantastic athletes have had people better than them, or they've lost games shockingly. I mean, we saw it in the Super Bowl recently. We see it in the Olympics right now, where you're just like, man, they had it all. But they have to have the grounding to navigate all these different things that come at you in sports. So my first one would be your child has to know their value outside of the sport. Did you have anything you want to add to it?
Speaker 1:Or no, I mean, you said enjoy it, which I think was really good advice because it ends, right? I mean, it ends. And the second thing you said was know your value, know your role, know your value, right? That I'm summarizing that. I want to make sure I do.
Speaker 2:Let me loop back in a little bit on the role. So, like by roles, I mean the roles and the impact you make start before the whistle blows. You know, people are like, oh, my kids just on scout team. No, there's no just on scout team. The scout team is hugely valuable to prepare the team for the day. They do all the work ahead of time. And so I would just say to be cautious on um diminishing, yes. We've done that before, diminishing any roles because it's a role. It's invaluable.
Speaker 1:I love that you said that. And I believe, tell me what you think about this. I think the sooner a kid realizes where their gifting is on that team, the more successful they'll be. Exactly. Because they can improve maybe something they're not as good at, but your real gifting can, and you can work with a coach on that, and you can get better at that, but your real gifting where you shine is right here. And and your team needs this skill set. For sure. And that is gold, no matter what it is. Scoring points, defense where you're not getting some of those um, you know, as many touchdowns and the limelight and that kind of line kind of works. Yes, yes, very important for them to know their role and and how critical it is. For sure. Yeah. For sure.
Speaker 2:The second thing I would say is for parents is to love your team. Um, sometimes this is hard because the way your child's role on the team sometimes affects the way you feel about the team. And I can, if I can say a thousand times, like I said, there's always teams. I mean, there's always a day where your kid's not the star, even if you're the best kid and you're going everywhere and you're doing everything where they've been so successful, you're gonna get a turn. Like we make a joke about it at home, like, ah, everybody gets a turn, everybody gets a turn getting beat when you, you know, or you get skunked. And and you have to love your team anyway. And God loves us anyway. You know, we make mistakes all the time. You drop a pass. You gotta love your kid, you know. Um, but you gotta love your team. And what I mean by that is, and it's something that I've seen um through the years of parents coming to me and asking me questions. And uh, you know, I show up. I've had seasons where I had a kid injured the whole entire season. I still went to every game. I sat there and cheered for the team. And I literally had somebody ask me why I was there when my kid's not playing. And I said, I I love the team. Like I'm here for the team. It's a difficult shift, especially if you're coming from club sports into varsity sports. It's a difficult shift, but it's super important to realize that your kid is learning that from you and they are seeing you support kids, even if you're not the star, even if you're not the focus. It's your team. I love your team. And that does include the coach. You gotta, you gotta get in there and be like, well, that's your coach, and we're gonna love him. And he's made by God, or she's made by God, and we're gonna support him. Doesn't mean you have to like everything and life isn't always sunshine and roses, but you have to love your team and you have to model that for your kids. At our house, we call it buying the shirts because when my son was looking at different colleges. Well, he's he's known our whole lives that we're all in. If you're on a team where that's the color we're wearing, we're all in. That's that's um, it's just part of who we are. We're very supportive. So when he was looking at different colleges and where he wanted to play, I would text him while he was on his officials and say, So are we buying the shirts or what? And every time he would just kind of ignore me, you know, well, there's mom texting about, you know, they had those overnights with their official visits. And so it would be in the morning. And I would want to know because we would get to visit the bookstore before we left. So if we were buying the shirts, I needed to buy them while we were there. There's some reason behind it. But when I asked him on the last visit we went to, and I said, buying the shirts, and I'm like, you know, we really want to know. Like, what does he think? And he said, Yes. It was so cool for us because we knew that he saw we were all in. And and to me, it was just like a full circle moment because he knew what I meant. Like, I wasn't like, Do you like the school? Do you like the coach? How is admins? It was just like, are we all in or are we not all in? And that's just kind of how we raised our kids in sports, and but that's how we modeled. Like, this is our team, this is who we love, this is our family. If somebody messes up at practice or they miss practice, or there's something going on, pick them up and pull them back in. We're all in. Wins and losses.
Speaker 1:You're all in. I love that. You mentioned your child had an injury and you still went to the games, which I think is amazing. I want to talk for a minute about injuries because my son had some very unexpected injuries through his high school career. And, you know, he went from training so many hours a day to not being able to do anything. And it was in those moments, like I really had to watch his mental health. I had to watch, again, the value, like, who are you? You're more than a basketball player, right? But but it is so critical. And I I know we we could probably do a whole podcast on this alone, but I just want to encourage parents out there that if your kid is an athlete and they've suffered an injury, it is a critical time for you to pour into them for their mental health. Watch their screen time because they're going from not being able to do anything and then all of a sudden they're online and they're feeling bad about themselves. They're worried that they're all their teammates are making progress and they aren't, and they see it. And so there's this panic of, I'm done. Yeah, I'm done. And I remember my son's had a couple injuries, but you know, the first one he came back from, we just like praised him for putting in the effort to come back after the injury because it's really easy to just say, I'm done now. And and sometimes it is career ending. But do you have any advice just to speak into injuries? Just pay attention to your kid in the world.
Speaker 2:For sure, it's probably one of the top two worst times of parenting through athletics are the injuries. When one of my girls um tore ACL, and so, and I saw it happen, and I just wanted to throw up when I was up in the stands because I knew what it meant. I knew it meant a year before she would be back if she was able to come back by themselves. You know, you see a lot of press and a lot of news, and kids can look up their own injuries with other people, and then people were like, oh, you know, um, Michael Parsons had that, and he was back in six months, and so you'll probably be back earlier. You know, I felt like we dealt with a lot of that where you're just like, no, we're not gonna be back in six months, you know, it's gonna be a year.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And um I I would pour into it in two ways. One, I would look for never diminish, like never diminish how they feel about it because you can't get stuck in it, but it is a real thing. It's a real loss. It's a loss of their expectations on the season, it's a loss on what shoulda, woulda, coulda's. It's a loss on all of that. And I feel like validating where they're at with it and just, man, this is just hard. Like not trying to fix it. You know, as moms, we're kind of fixers, like, well, let's get you involved in whatever, and then it'll be better. Well, it's sometimes it's just not better. But don't let them get stuck in there either. Try to get them back with their team as best, as quick as you can, back around the environment, in an environment to get better that is outside and physical as much as you can. Um, I would also say that um if they're competitive, which they probably are, find another way that they can win. That was like a funny joke we had. I was like, well, I've sat and played six games of spades today because she needed to beat somebody, but that's a real thing. They're competitive. And now you can't compete in any way the way you have before. So find another way that they can compete and have that get in there and you know, get after it with somebody. But uh, a lot of prayer, a lot of guidance, ask for new avenues to come into their life, God to show them a way to see the other side of it. Uh that was it's a really rough time.
Speaker 1:Injuries are tough. It it's a hard, it's a hard, that's a hard journey. And and we've seen, you know, teammates struggle with it too. I mean, it's just sure it's very difficult, very difficult. Um, you you said, you know, get them competitive. So I just have kind of a fun question for you. Okay. Because you guys are competitive. We are competitive. Your husband was an athlete, indeed. And uh, do you let your kids win?
Speaker 2:Never.
Speaker 1:Never, ever. Okay, tell me about that. Because some people are like, let your kids win, boost their confidence, don't you?
Speaker 2:Absolutely not. No fake confidence at our house. No fake confidence. I love that. Now that being said, we found things that they could win at at their age. So they may not be able to beat us in a race, or well, most of them could probably beat me a lot, but earlier than my husband. But at basketball or whatever games we were playing, there was no let anyone win. We would often do teams and break the family up and try to make it even, or we would play games that did not require an athletic ability of size or speed, like, Uno. That's the only one I can think of. Yeah. So it wasn't like, you know, the younger brother was the all-time loser at all sports or all activities, but my husband was adamant about not letting him win. And I can remember being like, but that's so ridiculous. Like you're you're bigger and stronger and faster. And he's like, I won't always be. And you're right, he's not always now, because now, you know, as I mean, we have a picture of the day my son caught him and passed him heightwise, and everything started to turn my girls, they're they're tough as nails, you know. And I try to stay out of like swimming pool basketball and that kind of stuff because I was the referee most of the time, and it's just not not anything that you want to get in the middle of.
Speaker 1:When you don't let them win, what I have found, because we really didn't let our kids win either, but there was a moment where we couldn't win anymore. You can't. Matt and I, we we were done, especially with my son in basketball, you know? And so it was he's stronger, bigger, and it helped his confidence, I think, because had we let him win all those years, he would be like, Are they letting me win or not? Right. But we we made him fight for the window.
Speaker 2:Well, they knew we weren't letting him win.
Speaker 1:It wasn't like we acted otherwise, they knew the rules, they chose to play. I mean, I guess it's different if they're two, right?
Speaker 2:But we're talking like well, you gotta keep those games age appropriate too, you know, races, um, competitions. Yeah, ping pong, you know, that's a good one too. But because there's a little luck in the city.
Speaker 1:Keep it competitive, yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay, so let me end with this conflict. Oh. So conflict with coaches, conflict with teammates, like, like I feel like if a parent, because we we lots of parents will say, I feel like this coach hates my kid. What should I do? Tell me how you would respond to that. If a parent called you today and said, This is what's happening, you know, should I call the coach? Now, this will probably vary by age, for sure. But walk me through this, how you would respond to that.
Speaker 2:Well, let's just pretend we're talking about like in the education system, like right in in high school. In high school. So we're in high school. Say sophomore. Okay. Sophomore. Um, the first thing I would say is a classic Mandy saying, I would say, give me an example of what you mean. What do you mean, my because I've never experienced anything that was outside of coaches being amazing people, but there are some examples that you hear about in the news, and that should be always be handled swiftly and quickly. So what do you mean? Yeah. That being said, my next question is usually has your kid talked to the coach? Have you stepped into that space? Have they stepped in and say who, what, when, where, why? Like what's what's going on? Oftentimes they will say no. And so I usually start with that encouragement. That's what I would tell my kids. I don't understand why whatever's happening. And I would say, have you asked them? And they would say, they don't want to talk to me, or you know, whatever, what kids say, right? I'm scared. I'm scared to talk. What if he gets mad? And you we would talk through based on usually, there's usually been a parent meeting before these times where the coaches have said, if you have any questions, come talk to me. And they say that on purpose. Now, the lesson you learn here is that you still may go talk to the coach, the child may, and not hear what they want to hear, and nothing may change with whatever the issue is, playing time or starting or whatever it is, position you're playing, that kind of thing. But the lesson is in the conversation, yeah. And stepping into a space of where you feel uncomfortable, they're gonna need that skill. They're gonna need it when they go to college, they're gonna need it throughout high school, they're gonna need it at their jobs, they need it with their family. Stepping into a space where you're not sure how they're gonna respond, but you're of integrity, respectful, schedule it. Don't just walk up and expect to have their time. You know, you schedule it like a meeting. May I come in and talk to you? I have some questions, yes, or tomorrow, or whatever works out with the coach. Usually they need a minute to get it on the calendar. Then you get it on the calendar and the kiddo has that discussion. That being said, I never have dealt with a situation where a coach wasn't also welcoming to a parent, um, either as a backup for the kid, to let the kid talk, to be a support system for the kid. There's a lot of talk nowadays that you hear about parents need to stay out of it at the high school level. Yes, I feel like to a degree the kid needs to take the step first in a learning environment, but I don't think that it's a no-parent environment either. I think it's a teaching environment for the child. And I definitely think, and in my experience, that coaches were open to having a conversation with the parents in the same setting. It can't be right up to the game. Yeah, it can't be when you're, I mean, don't when you're really mad, not in a heated environment. But that's based on my experience, and I had great experiences with it. And there are there is a lot to learn in club coaches. I would talk to them to ask them and understand the sports better because I don't know. We would pay um trainers to help in a specific position, and I would ask them, like, why are you working on that? I need to understand. And they would tell me, and I would learn so much, and then I would see it, and and you can validate that with your kiddo. Like, oh, I see you're trying whatever he taught you, or you know, so I feel like there's been this world and some club coaches. Right now, if they're listening to this, they're probably like, Why is she telling that? Because I there is a world where there's a it needs to be a balance. You can't be in their ear constantly trying to guide and direct it, in my opinion. It's not super healthy. But if your child, they're still a minor, they're still a kid when they're in high school, they're not out on their own. Now, as they transition from high school to college, you're done. To me, I and I would never reach out to a college coach or ask questions about college coaches or question anything. And it's nothing but hi, how are you? Thank you. It is they are adults and the kids need to deal with it in that set setting. But in high school, I feel like it's hard to navigate. You kids see things through their lens, their children. And what they're seeing or feeling is very real to them, but it's not necessarily the whole picture. And sometimes a coach can say, Well, at practice, I don't see him, you know, stepping to the front of the line and being the first one. Like there might be more things that can go into it that you don't see because you're not there. And they also have a lot of things going on that nobody can see.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And so we just see our kid.
Speaker 1:We don't see the big picture.
Speaker 2:And we see how it affects them and we hate it. Yeah. Which we, you know, and so it's, I definitely think with conflict, it's it's it's gonna happen. And you can enter into conversations, you can even disagree and still model for your family how to respect the different opinion that the coach has, and then be like, but what what's your role in all this, Johnny? To work hard to become better. Better version of myself.
Speaker 1:And yes, you know, coach says you are really good here. Let's focus on this. This is your role. Right. Yeah. Even though you may not be happy with it. That may what you need for that team.
Speaker 2:If you're basketball, you're not going in, but you keep working and working and working, you're a better basketball player. That is still a very big win.
Speaker 1:Nobody can take that from you. Nobody can take that from you. No amount of playing time or whatever, you're disciplined, you're learning hard work and you're you're getting better. And you're on the team. Yeah. Yeah. I I love that answer because I think it's so spot on. You know, gather the context first. Give me an example of what you mean the coach doesn't like you. Well, kids will say that to you too.
Speaker 2:He hates me, he doesn't play me, he likes such and such. Give me some examples. And and so it's with the kids and parents, like validate. I mean, and that and how you feel stinks sometimes. Yeah.
Speaker 1:It does. Yeah. And but I love that you said that first. Get the context. And then step two is like send your kid to talk to the coach. You know, schedule a time. Coach, I need to talk to you, see how that goes. And then kind of the third step is the parent may need to have a conversation after that meeting with the, but it's scheduled, it's not in a heated conversation. Uh, and honestly, if you think about it, that's biblical conflict resolution right there, Matthew 19, right? Where you go to the person first. And so we're it's so important. I always say this to my kid when I'm pushing them into a conversation with a teacher or a coach or whatever. I'm like, you are gonna need to do this with your professors, you're gonna need to do this at your job. It's such a skill. And so don't do it for them. But but as I love what you said, when they're in minor, though, you're you're still involved. You've got to parent it. Yeah, you've got to parent it if it doesn't get resolved one-on-one with the kid and the coach or the kid and teacher.
Speaker 2:Well, and if you just don't understand, you can follow up. Yeah. And and, you know, coaches, they want to win and they want their kids to be successful. And it may the way they get to that or don't get to that may not all you may not understand it all. But there I've I've never met a coach that didn't wake up caring about a kid, honest gosh. And so uh stepping into that space and hearing that from them, it may help you a lot process what you're seeing.
Speaker 1:Yeah. So we're talking about conflict with the coach, a conflict with teammates, because there's jealousy. There's I mean, it this happens on a team. You may be happy for this person, but you're a little jealous.
Speaker 2:Well, and the culture of the world doesn't help with that. Yeah. Because comparison, kids get, I mean, every single week in certain sports, kids are getting picked as the player of the week, and um, such and such got a highlight reel on the news, but you know, right after that he dropped the ball or whatever it is. I I used to joke with um a coach friend of mine, and I would say, you know, I just wish there was a way to outlaw any sports for high school kids on Twitter or on X or on the news, because it just creates this want to of them to be out there. But that's one aspect of conflict with kids that kids have to navigate through differently now, even more so probably now than when my kids first started in high school. I kind of saw it evolve over the years with um Instagram and TikToks are almost more like uh marketing tools for the kids. And so they're just people are seeing a lot more of them and they're out there a lot more. So it opens them up to more vulnerability, I feel like, of conflict. You know, we had some cases of conflict even without social media as my kids grew up, and it's difficult. Uh, kids like to be liked. You do, most of them do anyway. And it's hard to navigate kids that you've grown up with, like on the high school environment, and then something happens and they're not nice, or you're like, what the heck? What happened? You know, I would say that I don't have all the answers to it, and I don't know if I always handled it the best, but I always just tried to be a soft landing for my kids and not offer too, too much advice, but just kind of listen and let them process it. I found a lot of times one minute there would be a big conflict, and then the next minute it was gone and we'd moved on into something else. Loving them and supporting them as a friend, and loving them and supporting them as a team sometimes look different. And always, um, my kids always called it being, you know, staying in character, like on your team, you're competing and you're working together, and it's not personal, any outside conflict coming into the team. The team environment, the game environment is to win the game, and your own teammates shouldn't be your opponent, right? So dealing with the game setting was always one thing, but then everybody going out to eat afterwards and who's included and invited, that's where it can get hard. And you just have to keep them on track of supporting their team and loving their team and working through those friendships would be my best advice.
Speaker 1:I would say too, just from what I've learned, is a lot happens how parents talk about other teammates too. Yes. Right? Like if you're saying, I don't like this kid because of what you're hurting the team because you want your kid to see the best in that player. Yeah, everybody has faults on the team. For sure. But everybody shines in a certain way. And so the more you talk about, man, this person's really good at this, this person's really good at this, you're helping the team culture by by reminding your kid why this, what this role of this particular person is on the team. And so I think, you know, parents have to be really careful because we're in our home, we let our guard down, and we may be speaking badly of the coach or another player. For sure. And that could affect our kid and how they see the team or or the coach. Yeah.
Speaker 2:And it it kind of needles its way on into the team. And you um, you know, it goes back to loving your team, it goes back to recognizing biblically our words build up. Um, you know, our job is to support all the kids. I mean, I say all these things not to say that it's all easy. I mean, we deal, we all deal with sin, we all deal with struggle, we all love our kids so much, and you want them to be successful. And and it gets hard where you're like, oh, you know, comparison is the thief of joy, right? Like you think of all those things, but you've got to really like have a mental switch to enjoy the time that you're watching them play and love their team and value, like build into your kiddo to value themselves as a child of God. And their sport is this amazing extra thing that they get to do because God gave them this ability to run and jump or swim or climb or whatever it is. And to do that for the glory of God, it's it's it takes work, it takes practice, it takes acknowledging the fact that you're walking into that and it's not just something to stay busy on the weekends.
Speaker 1:I love how you phrase that because also at the end of the day, every kid, every person is gonna have to quit their sport someday, right? I mean, even the NFL players eventually have to retire. Yes. And so that identity piece is so important. And it just depends like when are you going, when is your career gonna end in this sport? Right, right, for sure. Um, and and I've heard you say before too, you know, everybody thinks college sports is like the finish line. But it's not. You were like, it's the starting line, it's a lot of things. It starts all over. Yes. And and we've talked before too about the pressure because you're always fighting for starting spot or fighting to maintain your starting spot. For sure. And that's a constant at any level. For sure. And so the the the carrot is dangled. And that's why I think it's so important the the identity of child of God has to be when you when you lose the starting role, when you go back up to starting role, whatever it is, um, you have to maintain that identity in your child.
Speaker 2:I mean, I worry about kids. Uh again, we could have another podcast about this, but I worry about kids and this grab of transfer portal and IL, all these things today, because it's it's just gotta be more than that. You it's gotta be. Like when we were looking at colleges and things, it's got to be where you can grow as a human being, in my opinion, and grow in your faith and and see, be able to live your be yourself and live out loud in your sport and and know who you are. Yeah. You know, and I think that is great.
Speaker 1:That is you weaving in faith to all aspects of the sports, and it's not just about the sports and the trophies.
Speaker 2:And I think there's some kids that are gonna do it well, and it's gonna all, you know, and they are doing it well, but it is always something I think about and and I think, oh, I just hope they know how valuable they are as a child of God in all that they're doing. Yeah.
Speaker 1:I think you touched on it slightly on the there's positive and negatives with social media with an athlete. Because I think it it kind of holds them to an accountability standard. Like if you want to play in college, your social media better be okay. Because they're watching you on social media. So there's also there's there's like a built-in awesome accountability with that. But the flip side of that is the pressure. The pressure. And so I don't know if you want to speak into that. I just think parents need to recognize there there's a positive and a negative.
Speaker 2:Um, with my son, it was mostly with him, is when it became um, because you know, in a short period of time, we saw a big evolution with the phones and the social media. What started out as a fun share pictures with my friends has grown into a full marketing scheme for these young, young men and women. And um, so for my son, a lot of his outreach with his coaches, I mean, the school he's playing at, he talked to the coach first on Twitter, you know. Um, and so I think that's still the norm. Kids post um their film, they post their highlights, you know, all their information is out there. You can tell where you're going to high school, you know, what you play, what position you play, everything. Their um NCAA numbers are on there, you know, it's a lot of information. So I would never ever say that anybody should walk that by themselves. I mean, they're in high school, they're also dealing with a lot of other stuff, and they need a parent, I mean, logged in with them on the social media apps where they're sharing public information. One, to be a screen for that of what all's coming in, and two, to help them say, hey, what is that school that's talking to you? Or hey, what was that that you posted? Or hey, um, I noticed in the news they posted the win of the other team, and everyone's talking about how great the other team was. To me, I used to always tell my children, turn off your phone after a loss. Like, give yourself the space to figure out how you feel about it. Um, my in my kids' high school, uh, when my son played, his coach wouldn't let him have phones on the ride, on the bus ride. Now, that meant a lot of times parents had no idea when to pick up their kids, which was funny because nobody knew when to pick up their kids. But they were able to just be together as a team without the outside influence, even if it was just for a 15, 20-minute bus ride. And I loved it because you need to figure out how you feel about something before you find out how the rest of the world feels about it. And that has to do with whether you're the superstar or whether you maybe messed up in that game and your team didn't win. You know, it's it gives you an opportunity to sit in it and then decide, okay, I'm okay. You know, I'm okay. And then you can go into the social media world. I do think when you have younger kids, like on varsity sports, if you have younger kids mixed with older kids, you really need to be paying attention to the influences there because you could have an 18-year-old turning 19 senior with a 14-year-old that just came from middle school. So I think it's a space that you need to be aware of and who's giving you your kid rides, like all of that kind of stuff pours into it, but the phones pour into it on that sense too, because they might be watching things or doing things or uh networking in ways that you're not ready for your 14-year-old to. So I think the phone aspect plays into sports a lot, um, a lot more than it used to.
Speaker 1:And then I just wanted to mention, and I know this, you know, we've talked about this. This wasn't really a thing when your kids were younger, but I have really noticed a shift in Next Talk probably the last five years, I guess, is just phones and locker rooms, uh, boundaries being crossed. And with, and what I mean by that is taking pictures of people changing, bullying, taking pictures in showers. Like we've been getting calls like that. And and I think it's because we, you know, the world is moving so fast with tech. And one of the things that I'm just trying to digest is we've always had kids changing in front of each other in locker rooms. And of course, there's been abuse, but we haven't seen it on the scale that I feel like I'm seeing it now. And I think a lot of it has to do with watch their what they're watching on their phones. I mean, we talk a lot about pornography here at Next Talk. I think a lot of kids are desensitized to seeing body parts and stuff. And so boundaries get crossed easily, whether it's touch or taking pictures or bullying, you know, those kinds of things we're becoming desensitized to. So I just want to kind of end the podcast. You know, we've got a podcast on boundaries, we've got a podcast on consent, we've got a podcast on um pornography. Like we'll link all of those for you. But but don't skip that conversation with your athlete.
Speaker 2:For sure.
Speaker 1:Because they are in a unique situation where they do get comfortable, you know, and then they're changing in front of each other. And we have to be careful with what they're seeing from their screens, and that we don't want that to bleed over and to be in an abusive situation in a locker room. And we are seeing more of that.
Speaker 2:Well, it goes back to teaching them from very little ages. And and the reason why you teach it at very little ages is so that when they get in those environments as they age, they remember like boundaries, what keeps me safe, what makes me a good friend and a teammate. What am I supposed to be doing in this environment? Um, I'm here to change clothes and get ready for the next thing. And I think changing a lot of the schools to not having the phones visible is helping.
Speaker 1:That that has helped tremendously. I mean, I've heard from parents who we've helped who have said, I'm so happy with the phone-free schools now because now I don't have to worry about in the logo.
Speaker 2:Videoing a prank was a thing. Videoing teachers, even and bullying teachers. And I think so. I think sticking with like trusting what you've taught, right? We've taught you from your little age, you know, you keep your hands to yourself, you're changing your modesty, doing all the things. And that carries over into everything you do with sports and and locker rooms and private spaces and acting of integrity.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and and being that safe place when they do see something weird in a locker room that causes them to maybe want to take up for somebody or speak up or something like that. Like you're the safe place constantly trying to help them navigate those things. I think that's so important. Any parting words, uh, we've covered a lot, and I feel like we could dive into each of these subjects and do a podcast on a whole series. Yeah. Uh, any parting words for parents of athletes out there?
Speaker 2:I would say, well, I already said enjoy it. But I asked one of my kids, one of my daughters, uh, I said, What if I could say one thing that would, you know, what would you recommend? Like, what would you recommend if I would say if I could do something different or do something else? And she said, save more game film. And I thought that was super sweet because you get so they are constantly looking at their game film, but they don't realize that they're gonna want to look at it again 10 years later or later on down the way. And so it's such an easy thing because huddle, like before, Mandy, before your season ends, get in there and save some of your huddle film because you're gonna want to go back and look at it. On a bigger picture, you know, uh the question about how your sport can become your God always lingers with me because it's about it's not a balance, it shouldn't be a balance. God is first. But I I fell back to thinking a lot about it and I was thinking, you know, Jesus was on a team, he was the captain, but he didn't walk alone out here. He he had his 12, and then now we're called to be all of us, we're all part of that same team. You know, there's not anything in your life that you're you're typically going to do solo. We're not designed to be solo, and so I just walk the path and still do with my kids with sports of relating it to scripture and relating it to Christ and how he lived and trying to pour into our community and serve others and lead and do your best. And they're all biblical characters. So when I think about besides game film, um, my go-to would be like, you know, just try to weave it in as much as you can. Church isn't just something you go to on Sundays where you sit there. You got to take it and try to impact lives with it and impact your family and help your family learn to impact other lives. So that's my takeaway. So good. Well, that's good. Thank you for all your advice.
Speaker 1:We survive varsity sports because of this one right here. You have great kids. You have great kids. A lot of calls in the in the I mean, it was just a whole new world for us and getting personal trainers and club sports and just the research, and and you she's always just been a steady try it. And then you can always just this could just be for a month and then you go somewhere else or whatever.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you do the best you can with the information you have. You step into it, you don't look back and say, should do it, coulda. And then at the end of the season, you make a new decision.
Speaker 1:Well, and there's also been seasons where my kid has come to us and said, I need a break. Like I'm burnt out. And honestly, he would come back better in the fall when he would take a break. And there were some summers that we took off for sure because he just said, I'm done. And I'm like, okay. And I didn't know if he was coming back, but it was his to figure out. You know, it wasn't me pressuring him or anything like that. It's got to be their journey. It does. And then, like you said, we're all in. We're teen, we're all in.
Speaker 2:Buy the shirts, buy the shirts.
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