7-year-old friends kissing private parts – how do we handle?

Chapters

• 1:42 Podcast Introduction
• 3:19 Nonprofit Mission: Keeping Kids Safe Online
• 19:29 Responding to Anonymous Questions from Listeners
• 51:25 Handling Sensitive Topics with Care
• 4:39:05 Practical Advice for Parents
• 15:00:00 The Importance of Counseling and Continued Conversations

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:01

Welcome to the Next Talk podcast. We are a nonprofit passionate about keeping kids safe online. We're learning together how to navigate tech, culture and faith with our kids. We received an anonymous question over the weekend and it looks like mom sent us a text through Apple Podcasts. Now we have that option turned on for our podcast, so a lot of the different platforms. You'll see a little link where you can say send us a message or text us a message, and I think that's what mom did in this situation. When you do that, those messages come directly to me and I read all of the ones that we get, but it's anonymous, so I don't know who you are and I can't get a hold of you.

Speaker 1: 0:47

And this message really caught me off guard and it was extremely important. It has not been the first time that I've been asked this question, even younger than seven years old, and honestly, I wanted so badly to get on the phone with mom and ask more questions, make sure the advice and the information that I was giving her was most helpful to that specific situation, and I also wanted to pray and encourage her. But I can't do that because I don't know who she is. So I've really thought about this and I'm going to do this podcast about it. There's a couple reasons why I'm doing this podcast. One is I want to reach this family and I want to talk to the mom directly and, mom, if you are listening, I'm going to act like I'm kind of just talking on the phone with you, so I hope that's okay. The other thing is I know this has happened before and I've been asked about it, and so I honestly want a podcast out there as a resource for families that if this happens and they're afraid to contact us or they don't want anyone else to know their names which I get that this is available to you. So, first of all, I do want to say I'm not going to screenshot or read the exact question, because there were some other details there and I'm trying to maintain privacy. Even though it's anonymous, it just feels kind of like an invasion of privacy to share a screenshot or something like that.

Speaker 1: 2:13

I am going to give you this context because I think it's just important and necessary for the conversation. So we have two seven-year-old buddies both boys and parents have found out that they're kissing each other's private parts. One of the kids said something, so that is. I know that doesn't feel like a win, but it's actually a huge, huge win that you didn't walk in on this. One of the kids is like wait a minute, I don't something's off here. So that is amazing that one of the kids spoke up. So that's first of all.

Speaker 1: 2:57

The other thing is I want to speak directly to mom, who contacted me first. Here's what I want to tell you you are so brave, I'm so proud of you, and I say this because sometimes, when we find out our kids are doing something and we're like, oh my gosh, they shouldn't be doing that, or they're too young for that, or whatever runs through our mind, their innocence is being stolen. We sometimes have a tendency to brush it under the rug or downplay it. And, mom, you're not doing that. You had the conversation with your kid and you're talking through it. But you also were like I need to reach out for help because am I missing something here? Like what else do I need to do? And that you are the best mom. Thank you for not sweeping this under the rug. Thank you for bringing it into the light. That's what we always want to do. That's our mission at Next Talk, right, and so I'm just so proud of you.

Speaker 1: 3:49

First of all, by talking about things like this, this is how we prevent abuse and consent issues and boundaries. This is how we prevent that from happening in the future. So it's about education and awareness raising awareness. Some people are still in the future. So it's about education and awareness raising awareness. Some people are still in the dark and they think this does not happen with seven-year-olds, and that is absolutely false. It's just extremely important, now that I'm getting more and more of these questions like this, that we bring it into the light and talk about it on a bigger scale.

Speaker 1: 4:25

Before I go into my practical talking points that I have for you, mom, I do want to say I reached out to some licensed professional counselors who are on our advisory council. I did that because one I wanted to make sure I wasn't missing any piece of information that I needed to pass on to you. I wanted to make sure I was getting this right, and my advice is coming from my decade long of experience working in this space and working with families just things I've learned over the years that kids are seeing and doing. That, combined with the mental health expert, is just a really the intersection of where our nonprofit meets and it's super beneficial, I think, for parents to make sure they're getting good, accurate, helpful information in situations like these. So, mom, as far as the practical stuff, if there is one thing that I want you to focus on in talking to your kid about this, it is this.

Speaker 1: 5:31

And you can rephrase this question. You can say it in your own words or how you think your kid would respond, but it is this. This is very important. Where did you get the idea to kiss a penis? What made you think of that? Again, you can rephrase it, you can say it however you want, but this is very important. And I want to tell you something when you ask this question, this is not a lecture, this is not accusatory, this is not shameful. This is a calm, logical conversation. I'm even going to add please be doing an activity where you don't have to look him in the eye, because I think he will be more honest with you.

Speaker 1: 6:17

So, for example, you know, deuteronomy 6, 6 and 7 says talk when your kids are going to bed. So crawl in bed with your kid, scratch his back, the lights are out and you're just talking to your kid. Hey, I'm, I want to check in on you I know it's been a lot these last couple of weeks with this happening and let him answer and, you know, see where he is and if he's in a talkative mood and he's opening up, then it goes into. You know, what gave you that idea to kiss a penis? Have you seen that in a movie, maybe before, or where did you see that? A question because we want to know what was in his little mind when he was thinking that that was okay. Now, mom, I'm giving you information and practical tools to talk about with your son. Okay, I want to step out of that for a minute and I want you and I to have a conversation about why this question is so important. Okay, this is not information that you're going to give to your son, but I want you to understand why this context is so important, because I really want you to dig into the root of what happens here. I'm just going to be really honest with you and I would tell you this if I were on the phone with you. Okay, this is mom to mom, from all the families who have helped over the last decade.

Speaker 1: 7:42

I think three things have may have happened here in the background to lead up to this. Okay, these are. These are the three things that are most likely to have occurred, and I'm going to do one in two, first, because I think they're most most likely to have occurred. And I'm going to do one and two first because I think they're most most likely to have occurred. One is your kid or the other kid saw pornography. If I had to bet, this is a hundred percent what happened, but I don't know, okay. So the other thing is your kid or the other kid may not have seen porn, but another kid did, and they told them. They told your boys about it. So your, your son and his friend, about what they this other kid had seen on a screen. Okay, this is a very likely scenario. This one, your kid or the other kid, saw porn too. They were told about porn by another kid. These two scenarios are most likely. What happened in this situation? And now they're acting out that idea that pornography put in their minds. If I had to bet, this is exactly what happened, okay.

Speaker 1: 8:53

Now I'm going to give you a third option that is going to sound scary to you, but it's important that you are aware, right, because we have to be aware. We can't be afraid. We can't parent what we don't know. The third thing is I'm concerned that maybe somebody else has inappropriately touched your son or the other buddy and we just need to make sure there's no abuse happening. Now you're not going to you, don't, don't again. This is you and me talking. This is not you talking to your son. This is you and me, mom to mom. When you're talking to your son, it's very calm, logical, open-ended. You know just where did you get the idea? Did you see this in a movie? You know what made you think to do this. That's all you're going to communicate to your son, but I am telling you the reasons why this question is so important to ask your son.

Speaker 1: 9:47

Okay, I'm giving you the insider information, mom to mom, about why we want to ask this question and dig into the, why we have to get to the root of what caused this, because that is going to be the real prevention piece in all of this, and we don't want this particular situation to impact how he is going to view his sex or his sexuality in the future. We don't want this to be defining something for him, and so it's very important that we push into this space and have some conversations. Now, when I reached out to our counselors, one of them gave me great advice and I actually want to read it to you, and I asked her if I could because it was so good. I don't want to butcher it. Here's what she said you always want to create the healthiest, most repairing narrative around the situation, because that is what they will carry moving forward and it also protects them from shame. So whatever narrative that is in your kid's brain right now through this conversation and experience, is what they're going to move forward with, and we need to make sure that is healthy and positive and not shaming. That is so, so important. Another tip from a counselor Also.

Speaker 1: 11:12

Maybe you want to say help me understand what kissing is. Can you describe it to me? Because we do need to gather more context about what happened and how far of a biological response the boys had in this situation. So I think that is extremely important too, and you can use words like help me understand. So I think that is extremely important too, and you can use words like help me understand. What we're getting there is just help me define what you mean when you say kissing. So that's important too.

Speaker 1: 11:43

Now there's a couple things that I want to remind you of as you're having these conversations with your son. One of our other counselors reminded me of this, how important this is. We say this all the time, but I just want to make sure you've got to avoid crazy parent mode. So if your kid starts opening up to you and sharing details about maybe a biological response that may have happened in reaction to the kissing, response that may have happened in reaction to the kissing, I need you to stay calm. I need you to not yell at your kid. Your kid doesn't know. Your kid doesn't know he's learning about his body right now. He has no idea that this is right, wrong crossing about. He doesn't know. And so be very gentle with your son.

Speaker 1: 12:30

Watch your facial expressions. I know for me like I have to really practice that I call it the mom filter, like I just have to stay calm and make sure my face isn't saying a reaction that I'm mad or upset or anything like that. And so, again, this is helpful if you're scratching his back at night, because then he can't see your face, or you're driving to practice and it's just he and you and you can talk and he can't really see your reaction Spaces like that work really well for the kid to open up, but for you too to hide your maybe facial expressions if you're bad about that. The other thing is just love your kid unconditionally. Like again, he's learning he doesn't know, so don't shame him, don't be accusatory, don't say things like what were you thinking? And if you did say things like that, if you're like well, I already did that. You know what I'm getting ready to say here.

Speaker 1: 13:25

If you followed, next, talk for any amount of time, circle back and apologize. I'm sorry that I said that to you. You know I'm upset that you're living in a world where this is something you guys think about. It just shouldn't be at seven years old. But I'm not mad at you. You were opening up to me and then I just went ballistic and I realized that is not the right response and I shut down all communication. So you can circle back and apologize if you need to, but we've got to get your kid talking about what happened and I know that's scary. But I also know you're brave because you reached out and I also know you don't want to shove it under the rug.

Speaker 1: 14:03

I am literally praying that God will take this curse and turn it into a blessing for you. For me, it was my kid getting exposed to porn, and now I'm on the other side of that and I see that it changed our family forever because it forced us to talk about things in the culture that we were never talking about. And so that's what I'm praying for you that God would take this curse and turn it into a blessing. In Deuteronomy it actually says that God will turn the intended curse into a blessing because he loves you, so I want you to hold on to that. I know it feels like his innocence has been stolen and you're never coming back from this and this is going to define everything. Stop. God can take this curse and make it into a blessing, but we do have to walk in obedience and have the hard conversations. We do have to pour into this and do hard work and talk to our kids about it, okay. The other thing is this as you're having these conversations with your kids, it is extremely important that you are mom and you do not walk into therapist row. I highly recommend counseling for your son. Again, it's helping him shape the narrative about what just happened. But you are mom, you are safe place, you're understanding, you're getting context, you're loving, you're practical, but a counselor will come in and help reframe the narrative on what the kid will take going forward in the future, and I think this is extremely important. Now, if you are in Texas, we have counselors on our advisory council. You can go to our website about team, see who our advisor councils are and contact them.

Speaker 1: 15:47

Okay, jamie Mershon was just on our podcast. She talked about body image. I would go listen to that show. She has one segment in there, even though it was about body image. It would relate to this because it talks about a horse going back and forth and about how the brain develops a narrative on what we tell ourselves over and, over and over again. And this is exactly what we're talking about. We don't want to. We don't want a weird or unhealthy narrative to form in your kid's brain about what just happened. So that's why counseling is extremely important, and we're not counselors I'm not a counselor so so we need, we need to be mom and we need to let counselors be counselors. So for sure, do that.

Speaker 1: 16:27

Now I do want to say this If you are in San Antonio, the surrounding areas, we have a reduced fee counseling program at our nonprofit. You will have to contact us for that. So, on our website, go to get help, go to reduced fee counseling and fill out that form. You can be very general, but we use grant and donor dollars to support this program, so we have to just make sure that where our dollars are going are to, you know, real kids who need real counseling. But that is open to you. If you're like I can't afford counseling, I want to just throw that out there.

Speaker 1: 17:06

The other thing as you're talking with your son, there needs to be a lot of new conversations about boundaries and consent and on this podcast I'm going to link those shows. Those are all separate talking points that need to be brought into this conversation. And so listen to those podcasts and again, make this part of your daily routine. The last thing, and anybody who's listening right now and you're like this has never happened in my home, but how do I prevent it? One, listen to the boundaries and consent show for sure, and use those practical talking points.

Speaker 1: 17:39

But the other thing is this use our red flag alert system. So this is something I developed in my own home with my own children. I didn't call it red flag alerts back then, but we've kind of developed a resource where it can be printable to you. Let me tell you why this is helpful In this situation. One of the things on the list and these are we list out things that kids need to report to us. They're red flag reporting guidelines, and it just why we call them red flags is if something happens on this list, we want a red flag to go off in their brain that uh-oh, this is something I need to tell mom or dad about. So in this situation, one of the things on our red flag list is anything about body parts or if you see anyone in a swimsuit or less. So those are two different guidelines on our red flag alert system that if the kid had been told this since three years old, then maybe maybe not always, it doesn't always, not a hundred, but maybe the kid an alarm would have gone off in their brain Uh-oh, red flag alert, I need to go tell mom or dad. So if you are listening to this podcast and you're like this is scary, I don't want this to happen to my kid, then I am begging you to implement the red flag reporting system in your home today. It's a free downloadable and I'm going to link it below as well. Last thing, and I'm going to link it below as well Last thing, mom, I want to say to you again, and I want to reiterate, thank you for reaching out to our show.

Speaker 1: 19:12

I know you were probably hesitant because you didn't want anyone to know who you are, and I hope that you're not upset with me sharing this podcast, but I really prayed about it and felt led that it would help so many people, and I think your bravery is what initiated that. So I truly believe, because you reached out and shared this with me, that now I can share your story anonymously and protect your family. But we can help other families together, and this is what Next Talk is all about. But I do. If I were on the phone with you right now, what I would say is can I pray with you? And so I just want to do that right now on the air. I know it's kind of weird, but I would do it on the phone with you and I can't talk to you directly, and so I want to do that now.

Speaker 1: 19:59

Dear Lord, we love you so much and I praise you and thank you for this sweet family and this sweet little boy and his friend and I just thank you so much that one of the boys reported this and said oh, something's we're doing this man. What a win. And I don't know if that was your conviction in that little boy. I don't know if that was just awareness or prevention pieces that his parents have taught him Like I don't know. But thank you, lord, for bringing it into the light and thank you for this brave mom who reached out who said this happened. Can you help? I feel like I'm missing some more deeper conversations here happen. Can you help? I feel like I'm missing some more deeper conversations here.

Speaker 1: 20:49

Dear Lord, I pray specifically right now for these two little boys. I pray that you give them courage to talk to their mom or dad, to talk to a therapist. Dear Lord, I pray that you take this curse and you turn it into a blessing for these boys, that it's something they will look back on as a learning experience and something that drew them closer to their parents, and I just pray that you use it for good, because I know you can use it for good, because I know you can. We love you so much. We thank you for your wisdom, dear Lord. Thank you for your wisdom when I don't know what to say. You've given me the words to say. I pray this for these parents right now that if they don't know what to say or how to phrase a question or how to ask it, I pray that you give them wisdom. We love you and we thank you. It's in Jesus' name I pray, amen.

Speaker 1: 21:50

Mom, I do want to say one more thing to you, and I always say this to the parents when I talk to them on the phone I am not God and I do not know your son. I do not know your family dynamic and I do not know your son. I do not know your family dynamic and I give you advice and tools that I have learned over the last decade and that counselors have taught me, but I want you to watch the show, listen to this show. I want you to pray about it. Lord, what is my next step with my son? Give me the wisdom and God is going to give you the words that you need to say to your kid Guys we're always here for you at Next Talk. We're here to help you and come alongside of you. You are not alone.

Speaker 2: 22:41

Next Talk is a 501c3 nonprofit keeping kids safe online. To support our work, make a donation at nexttalkorg. Next Talk resources are not intended to replace the advice of a trained healthcare or legal professional, or to diagnose, treat or otherwise render expert advice regarding any type of medical, psychological, legal, financial or other problem. You are advised to consult a qualified expert for your personal treatment plan.